What's wrong with a Streetlite? (1 Viewer)

D

Deleted member 422

Essentially.

But to be more specific, I mean the SK17s used on route 410. Maybe because they aren't as old as the LK66s (which produce that smoke like smell) why I prefer these models overall, but it's fun, despite the weak engine, which makes a good sound, the stop start system is atleast a positive over the Enviro 200s and even today I thought the design has really grown on me.

Its the Streetlite's quirks that I find fun. The quick acceleration and surprisingly good leg room, at the back is what I like about the bus, which is what the Enviro 200 can't provide

The Enviro 200 is a great bus overall, but it's not as interesting or as exclusive as the Streetlite. The engine is bland to listen to, all seats are painfully squeezed together and on the tight roads the 410 traverses through, it tends to get stuck, or has to reverse more often, maybe because the steering rack is heavier or something.

The earlier Enviro 200s, especially back in its inception, around 2006, were worse than the Streetlite. The layout, specifically on the one door 8.9m buses were terrible, coupled with a noisy engine, cramped interior and woeful suspension. It had none of the quirks of the Streetlite either. No love it/hate it exterior design or 'fun' factor.

To make things clear, I'm comparing the 9.5m Streetlite and 9.6m Enviro 200. As I haven't ridden a bigger Streetlite, I can't give my verdict on it. Maybe its better, or maybe its worse, but the 10.2m Enviro 200s are alright for the most part.

I known buses are just meant to get you from A to B, but I prefer making those journeys on a Streetlite. The interior is fine, its the specific seats used that are the issue, but I guess its my preference to the underdog.
No comment on the non-existent suspension, well known engine faults, lack of power, numerous other faults ranging from brake pad fires to broken doors, poor interior design (more so on WFs, where some poles are so close together, it renders parts of the bus inaccessible) etc etc etc. This is what you look for in a bus? I know its a matter of opinion but jeez...
 
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No comment on the non-existent suspension, well known engine faults, lack of power, numerous other faults ranging from brake pad fires to broken doors, poor interior design (more so on WFs, where some poles are so close together, it renders parts of the bus inaccessible) etc etc etc. This is what you look for in a bus? I know its a matter of opinion but jeez...

I don't know what you've seen first hand, but I've never seen a brake pad fire, faulty doors or a Streetlite broken down before, and I see them everyday.

It's likely that older models suffer from this problem, I'm assuming, as the ones on the 410 and 450 routes are fairly new.

Again, the variations matter, as they may not be as well made, and so on and so forth.
 

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LazyGuy222

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Wouldn't an extra door make the bus heavier, depending on the door's wheelchair system and price, and wouldn't reduce the interior space?

The Enviro 200's plates are LJ12s.

What are your Enviro 200s properties? Length, Year and Doors?
I'm not talking about any properties, anyway, ADL know how to improve buses, whereas WrightBus cannot. Also, no It would not as It replaces the metal which is already there.
 
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I'm not talking about any properties, anyway, ADL know how to improve buses, whereas WrightBus cannot. Also, no It would not as It replaces the metal which is already there.

What I said afterwards wasn't directed at you.

I know that ADL have improved their buses, especially the Enviro 400's, as the MMC's over here on their original chassis are quick and spacious.
My point only refers to the Streetlite and not the company as a whole.

If you're backing ADL, then okay, I understand your point and I agree, but if you read my posts before, I was bashing the first iterations of the Enviro 200, but they have improved overtime as said before with the 14/15 reg buses.

To quote myself ' I personally prefer the Enviro 200s anyway, even the comparable 9.6m iteration. I'm only saying that the Streetlite, despite its various flaws, aren't the worst bus ever'

About the weight issue again, it depends yet again on the bus. The metal isn't always going to be the same width on every bus, and as we're referring to the Streetlite, it's likely thinner than the Enviro 200s.
 
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D

Deleted member 422

I don't know what you've seen first hand, but I've never seen a brake pad fire, faulty doors or a Streetlite broken down before, and I see them everyday.

It's likely that older models suffer from this problem, I'm assuming, as the ones on the 410 and 450 routes are fairly new.

Again, the variations matter, as they may not be as well made, and so on and so forth.
The brake pad fire, was an Arriva Southern Counties DF Streetlite, from Northfleet I think, on the 477, the remaining faults, are spread across GAL WS1-WS9, which are all LJ12 plated Streetlites from GAL Metrobus' Orpington garage :P
 
The route I get from college is operated by Arriva Sapphire Streetlites and VDL SB200s, and the streetlites are not fit for purpose on practically any Arriva route round here. They're all regional routes with short distances between stops in towns, and long distances between stops out of town, sometimes up to 2 miles on the 22 with them running at up to 50 mph.

They're cramped, uncomfortable, underpowered (can't even get up the Hawthorn bank after stopping at the bottom even when it's bone dry whereas an SB200, E400, VDL decker, Solo, Dart to name a few, can get up it from that stop like it doesn't exist), increadibly noisy, very flimsy, frequently break down and possibly the ugliest bus available.

The wheel forward varient is even worse somehow, though thankfully never seen one 'in the flesh'. GNE's Streetlites, while still terrible, are used on more suitable routes, such as the 60, 2 and 2A, as they don't have long distances between stops. TBH, the only thing going for streetlites IMHO is the high roof at the back.

Rant over.
 
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May 2, 2017
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The route I get from college is operated by Arriva Sapphire Streetlites and VDL SB200s, and the streetlites are not fit for purpose on practically any Arriva route round here. They're all regional routes with short distances between stops in towns, and long distances between stops out of town, sometimes up to 2 miles on the 22 with them running at up to 50 mph.

They're cramped, uncomfortable, underpowered (can't even get up the Hawthorn bank after stopping at the bottom even when it's bone dry whereas an SB200, E400, VDL decker, Solo, Dart to name a few, can get up it from that stop like it doesn't exist), increadibly noisy, very flimsy, frequently break down and possibly the ugliest bus available.

The wheel forward varient is even worse somehow, though thankfully never seen one 'in the flesh'. GNE's Streetlites, while still terrible, are used on more suitable routes, such as the 60, 2 and 2A, as they don't have long distances between stops. TBH, the only thing going for streetlites IMHO is the high roof at the back.

Rant over.

The Euro 6 engines and the Micro-hybrid technology (neither are featured on GNE's 60 or 53/54 IIRC) make streetlites a very strong business decision. They get paid by the council to run buses that are this eco-friendly with the so-called BSOG payment. Throw in WIFI, Chargers, NSAs and comfier chairs, and most passengers will like them too. The only fault that is worth considering on a wider-scale is the gearbox, which everybody can admit are notorious for slipping. Other than that, both business side and passenger side - is there really anything wrong with them? Not really.
 

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In my experience, they're terrible, and passengers on the 22 seem to dislike them as well. Anyway, it doesn't change the fact they are NOT fit for purpose on the 22.

I'm assuming you'd want big mercs running around on the service right? The sorts of buses that you would typically associate with higher-speed and place-bo comfort would be the likes the Citaro. These are not cheap to run and there is little-to-no council subsidy involved in the running of them. To an uninformed passenger, there is very little difference. You get a seat and some features. It's a bus, you're going to get people who complain about the quality not being as comfy as it could be. Any driver will tell you that a Streetlite gives you back-pains and there's no suspension - but you feel like that after spending any number of hours in a bus. The only exception could be a driver's seat on a Gemini 2 body. There's a lot of nonsense spread around, and it makes very little difference in the real world besides the expense to run the vehicle. Granted, the gear-boxes on the 64/15 plate streetlites may as well be paper from an engineering point of view - but again, with the introduction of 66/17/67 plate models, there is a difference in this.

I'd say a Streetlite, for the economic and placebo passenger experience differences considered - they are definitely worth running on routes like Arriva's 22. Most of the time, Go North East's 15 plate streelites so a good job on the 8/78/78A - a set of routes in a very similar nature to the 22.
 
Yeah, they might be cheaper to run, but they frequently break down, cause delays and really struggle on the hawthorn bank. There is only one bus that does worse on that hill and it's a Volvo D10M which Pygall's used to use on the school runs. I don't think a citaro would do a lot better on that hill.

Also, I'd prefer they use VDL SB200s on the 22 all the time.
 
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Yeah, they might be cheaper to run, but they frequently break down, cause delays and really struggle on the hawthorn bank. There is only one bus that does worse on that hill and it's a Volvo D10M which Pygall's used to use on the school runs. I don't think a citaro would do a lot better on that hill.

A Citaro from this Century wouldn't struggle up any hills we have around here. Go North East's 52XX series have been going up steep inclines for most of their lives and don't feel any worse off. The 66-plate streetlites you will find in their place, also do just as well. Food for thought.

VDL SB200s

I do not know much about these buses. There's not much good information on them. However, mechanically they aren't much different from a Streetlite. I would expect a Pulsar to be even less comfortable as those Cummins aren't the smoothest ride ever. Not knocking either, but I don't think the difference between the two are meaningful in this situation. There are buses in each batch that are "better" and "worse" that may prove an exception. They generally are reliable though. Wright's Customcare will look after vehicles within a select range of years after purchase to make sure they're working fine. I do think with the newer generations of streetlites being introduced, we should be looking at them with good potential and practical solutions. I think there's too much non-sense in the enthusiast communities about buses that aren't powerful. Sure, they're not as powerful on paper and are prone to rattling -- but in the grand scheme of things, with the updated gearbox work, I think they're a sensible choice. I have good hopes for the ANE X1/1 allocation of new streetlites, and they look smart-as in the new liveries.

If ADL can mass-produce a plastic bus, the E200, and have them running long-distance shuttles between Newcastle and Carlisle with moderate success and without anybody complaining -- why is there such an issue with a Streelite (again, uses the same gearbox and engine as a E200) being on similar conditions for a 2 mile stretch?
 
You can enjoy your supposedly luxury streetlites, but they ALL are absolute hell for someone of my height compared to a VDL SB200. The VDLs are much more comfortable (in that they don't randomly accellerate when coming out of Peterlee Bus Station - definitely a heart-in-your-mouth moment) and actually have leg room.
 
D

Deleted member 422

The Euro 6 engines and the Micro-hybrid technology (neither are featured on GNE's 60 or 53/54 IIRC) make streetlites a very strong business decision. They get paid by the council to run buses that are this eco-friendly with the so-called BSOG payment. Throw in WIFI, Chargers, NSAs and comfier chairs, and most passengers will like them too. The only fault that is worth considering on a wider-scale is the gearbox, which everybody can admit are notorious for slipping. Other than that, both business side and passenger side - is there really anything wrong with them? Not really.
Business side, are they really practical with their known tendency to develop faults? Passenger side, are they really practical when they don't turn up, give an uncomfortable ride, or just a bad experience overall? I think it depends a little on the area, some places they seem to do really well. but here, both passengers and drivers alike prefer the Enviro200, Dart MPD, or Dart Esteems to the WF Streetlites anyday :)
 
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Business side, are they really practical with their known tendency to develop faults? Passenger side, are they really practical when they don't turn up, give an uncomfortable ride, or just a bad experience overall? I think it depends a little on the area, some places they seem to do really well. but here, both passengers and drivers alike prefer the Enviro200, Dart MPD, or Dart Esteems to the WF Streetlites anyday :)

I cannot speculate on the WF streetlites, but I imagine it's the same deal. Enviro200s are similar to Streetlites, more similar than one would think -- I don't really understand how you can like one more than the other when the only real difference is that a Streetlite earns the operator money from the council, via it's MicroHybrid technology.
 

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LazyGuy222

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I cannot speculate on the WF streetlites, but I imagine it's the same deal. Enviro200s are similar to Streetlites, more similar than one would think -- I don't really understand how you can like one more than the other when the only real difference is that a Streetlite earns the operator money from the council, via it's MicroHybrid technology.
Tell me, what has had more sales from 2016? The E200 or Streetlite?
 
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Tell me, what has had more sales from 2016? The E200 or Streetlite?

I do not know the figures off of the top of my head - but I don't think it's relevant to this situation. Operators stick generally with a specific set of manufacturers because of business deals. That is likely to affect any business decision, more than passenger "reviews". The difference between replacing a fleet of E200s with a fleet of Streetlites is probably not worth the difference - but that's not the point here. The point is that there's barely any discrepancy between the two. How can there be so much bad-press on a Streetlite over an ADL E200, when they are the same mechanically -- with the Streetlite offering more eco-friendliness?
 

LazyGuy222

Resident First Leicester Enthusiast
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I
I do not know the figures off of the top of my head - but I don't think it's relevant to this situation. Operators stick generally with a specific set of manufacturers because of business deals. That is likely to affect any business decision, more than passenger "reviews". The difference between replacing a fleet of E200s with a fleet of Streetlites is probably not worth the difference - but that's not the point here. The point is that there's barely any discrepancy between the two. How can there be so much bad-press on a Streetlite over an ADL E200, when they are the same mechanically -- with the Streetlite offering more eco-friendliness?
It is relevant, as if one is bought more, its doing better.
 
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It is relevant, as if one is bought more, its doing better.

Please read my insight -- a company who chooses to pursue ADL orders will generally stick with ADL because they will offer subsidization for being longer standing customers. It is by no means a measure of which are "better", especially when the difference mechanically is a Micro-hybrid system.
 
D

Deleted member 422

I do not know the figures off of the top of my head - but I don't think it's relevant to this situation. Operators stick generally with a specific set of manufacturers because of business deals. That is likely to affect any business decision, more than passenger "reviews". The difference between replacing a fleet of E200s with a fleet of Streetlites is probably not worth the difference - but that's not the point here. The point is that there's barely any discrepancy between the two. How can there be so much bad-press on a Streetlite over an ADL E200, when they are the same mechanically -- with the Streetlite offering more eco-friendliness?
The E200 and Streetlite may be similar mechanically, but none of the chassis, or engine is used in both as far as I'm aware. There is also some serious differences. The lack of suspension, power, and large occurrence of faults within the mechanics and design of the Streelite, do not become present on the Enviro200 models, which end up overriding any sort of payment for having a micro-hybrid system.
 
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The E200 and Streetlite may be similar mechanically, but none of the chassis, or engine is used in both as far as I'm aware. There is also some serious differences. The lack of suspension, power, and large occurrence of faults within the mechanics and design of the Streelite, do not become present on the Enviro200 models, which end up overriding any sort of payment for having a micro-hybrid system.

Same engine, same gearbox if you're looking at Cummins. That is what I'm talking about with mechanically similar. The suspension will be pretty much the same, power and faults will be down to the engineering team who deal with the buses.
 

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